How to Trust Your Parent Gut: Megan Cordaro on Letting Go of the Life You Planned + Harvest Grain Bowl

What happens when the life you thought you’d have collides with the reality of motherhood?

In this powerful episode, Megan Cordaro, mom of five and Certified Birth Doula, joins Reesa Morala, LMFT, to share her raw and emotional journey of pregnancy, parenting, and sacrifice. Megan opens up about being pregnant with twins while her husband was deployed to Iraq, the overwhelming grief and resentment of letting go of personal dreams, and the hard-earned wisdom of learning to trust her parenting instincts.

As they dive deep into navigating motherhood, self-advocacy, and resilience, Megan also shares her nourishing Harvest Grain Bowl recipe—a comforting, wholesome dish perfect for busy parents.

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 Find Megan: www.megancordaro.com

 Instagram: @meganbcordaro

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Harvest Grain Bowl

INGREDIENTS:

1 Bag of Harvest Grain from Trader Joe's

4 c of Chicken or Vegetable Broth

1/4 c of butter

Frozen Vegetables

Feta Cheese for serving 

INSTRUCTIONS:

1. Make the Harvest Grains according to the package. 

2. Add frozen vegetables (whatever you have on hand) when adding the grains. They may need a couple more minutes to cook then the directions say, so keep an eye on them, stirring to check for liquid and to prevent burning. 

3. Once done, serve with Feta cheese. 

*You can also add any leftover chicken from another meal, if you're looking to boost protein. 

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Postpartum Support International:

https://www.postpartum.net/

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Disclaimer: 

The insights shared on this platform are for informational and educational purposes only and do not constitute professional advice or treatment.

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Host: Reesa Morala, MA, Licensed Marriage and Family Therapist. Reesa is a couples counselor for parents providing therapy in person in Murrieta, CA and virtual couples therapy in California. Find Reesa hosting couples and parenting workshops nationwide!

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For the video version of this episode find us at: https://www.embracerenewaltherapy.com

If you are a parent ready to share your real-life parenting struggle and dish up a recipe with Reesa, apply here:
https://www.embracerenewaltherapy.com/real-family-eats-guest

If you are experiencing a mental health crisis or need personalized support, please seek help from a licensed mental health professional. If you are in immediate danger or experiencing a crisis, contact emergency services or a crisis hotline in your area.

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Go to your local hospital or call 911

Transcript

0:00

Not to say that I didn't love them or enjoy moments with them. Yeah. But there was a real resentment and regret and grief. Hi everyone. Thanks for joining me. My name is Reesa, and I'm your host. We are talking to real families about real stories here on The real Family Eats, where we've got food for thought and thoughtful food. So let's eat. Hey, everyone. Okay, so my guest today is Megan. Hi, Megan. Thank you so much for joining us today. Thank you for having me. Yes. I am so excited to hear about your story. We've got a very special story for everyone and also to learn about this recipe. I have not tried this one, so I'm super excited. But before we do this for anybody who doesn't know you would mind introducing yourself. So my name is Megan Cordaro. I am a mom to five kiddos ages 19, 19, 17, 13, and 10. I think we all remember them all. You know, some kids live in your mind, just like one age it takes a while to jump to the next. Yeah. So I have to think about that. And I am currently working as a birth and postpartum doula, a parent, counselor and I run support groups down at Rock Rose School. Wonderful. So for anybody who is looking for some of those support services, and it sounds like you are are providing our community, which is so neat and so exciting, how can anybody find you? My website. Okay. W w w dot Megan cordero.com. I'm sure that you'll. Yeah they will. It will be underneath hopefully in this banner right around here. And I will link it in our show notes as well. For anybody who's looking for some of the support services. And I do parent like counseling and coaching outside of the school too. Okay. Another parent groups that would be accessible. Wonderful. Oh, that's so awesome. Okay. So tell me what recipe we're making today. And why did you choose this one? Okay, so this is the most basic recipe, but I chose it because it's so easy. And it's like I would always just have all the ingredients in my fridge. Okay, so this is one of those like, oh crap, I don't know what I'm making for dinner dinners. When the kids are little happened a lot. Luckily, this was one of those things that the kids always eat. Really? Okay, we're never like, oh, we have to have fun again. Like, everybody always was like, oh yeah, harvest greens. Yeah. So it's very easy. It's not fancy at all. But I knew that this would be this is one of my recipes that I share with a lot of my families. And it's so easy. Yeah. And it sounds like super nutritious. Staff just wanna make sure their bellies are full, as you mentioned, especially in that kind of survival cinch. Parenting. I know what you need. You just need something. Like you said, I can put it on. I already have kind of all the ingredients and not having to go out and make an extra chip, especially with exactly a full load of kids. You know, that's that's a task in itself. It's a lot. And my husband's a firefighter. Okay. So he was gone a lot. Sometimes he'd be gone for like 3 or 4 days at a time. So it was like this was the easy like this was literally once a week. Yeah. Made perfect. Okay. So, if you could tell me kind of the steps, what are we going to be doing? I can get things started while we chat a little bit about your story. Sure. Very easy. You know the chicken broth. Okay. And then, I put a little bit of butter in there as well, just for flavor. And I get, like a little bit more water. Another type of oil into if you're dairy free. The other thing about this recipe that's great is you can do a lot of different things with it. You could do vegetable broth instead of chicken broth okay. Some kind of oil, like if you're vegetarian at different stages. When I was pregnant, I often gave up dairy. Okay. And I so that was mess with this a lot and it was always so really good. So you're going to heat the chicken broth with some sort of oil or something else in there. Okay. And then once all that comes to a boil, you put in the serving of harvest greens with the vegetables. Another great thing. You put whatever vegetables you have on hand. Okay. My favorites were always like corn and peas and broccoli. But like, if I had chosen green beans with whatever frozen vegetable I had or like, you know, half the bag, I hadn't used that or something. I would just throw that in perfect. And then I'll just cook, okay, until it's done. Okay? And I can do that. We look towards the ends of when it says it's going to be done. I think it's like ten minutes. I just kind of keep checking because the veggies do make it a little bit more liquidy. Okay. So sometimes you need to cook it a little bit longer. But we check often because the bottom does burn okay quite quickly but to not which is also fine. Yeah. Think because then the bottom is just discarded in the rest of it's still good reason. This is a very good and easy recipe where you can add a little crispiness. Yeah, I think yeah I love it. Okay. So I'll get this stuff going. And I'll make sure to get it to that boil and then we'll, we'll get going. I know one of the things that we wanted to chat about, I specifically asked if you could chat about, was the fact that you have a little bit of a unique kind of outside parenting journey, especially with your first kiddos and, and that's something even though it's unique in the sense that not it's not a widely publicized kind of everyone has the same journey. It's it's one that actually a lot of my parents relate to. And so I would love for you to kind of chat a little bit. Can you kind of set the stage for us and, and share for me kind of what that was like the first. Yeah. So, a little bit of backstory. I was getting my master's degree in social work, really trying to, like, plan everything out. My husband really wanted kids, and I was like, no, I want to finish my degree. So I said, fine, we could start hiring right before I started my second year, okay? Thinking that if I got pregnant, I would have the babies right as I graduated. Everything's good. Right? I have my degree. I'll start my hours. Everything will be great. Yeah. Have the baby that we wanted to do it all right. I feel like that's how so many of us like where we can make this plan. I can totally do it. We. Maybe your life changes, but it's great. It's just like an easy, wonderful addition. And it's like your love just grows and everything's beautiful and happy with the baby. Yeah. So that that didn't work out. I mean, everything's great, but that did not play out in the way that I had anticipated. So, and I think that that's the that's common thing for me now. So I, found out that I was pregnant. Okay. A week after we found out that my husband was getting mobilized to be deployed to Iraq. Oh my goodness. Yeah. So he was in the Army Reserves. He's a firefighter on the civilian side, but in the Army Reserves. And this was during all that. And he got a call saying that he was getting transferred to a unit in New York. And for two days we were like, Thank God it's not Iraq. You're just going to New York. I can still come visit like, no big deal. Yeah. And then after a couple days, we found out, no, he's getting transferred to the unit in New York that is getting to deploy Iraq. Oh my goodness. So we found that out. I was at dinner with, with him at his dad's house and sort of like, you're going to be leaving, come to dinner kind of a thing. Yeah. And on the way home, I was like, I am more tired than I have ever been in my entire life. And I had done, like, you know, finals in college, like, I don't know, like I've been up for 36 to 48 hours before. Yeah. And I still had not felt as tired as I felt like that night. And that's such a true thing. I want to just pause for a moment because I absolutely relate to that. I felt like I said the same thing, you know, when I was in, undergrad, it was like, oh, you know, those late nights studying, you're like, oh, I'm so tired of, you know, the most tired I've ever been. And you go to grad school and you're like, oh, no, I didn't know what I was talking about. And then, like you said, you said to me, I'm pregnant. And that tiredness is just something that's so difficult to communicate to someone like what it's like. It is. Absolutely. So I like you core to your bones. You're just so exhausted. So. Yeah. So we found out that night that I was pregnant, which was not the story that I wanted at this happy like we're that. Yeah. It was we were happy. But it was also incredibly bittersweet. Yes. We knew that in a week you'll be leaving. So what was going through your mind? And I hope he comes back. Yeah. That sounds incredibly scary. Yeah that was it. But it, and it was also that I didn't it was, it was the set up for like all of my parenting basically, which is like the ability to hold two things at one. At least the two things. Yeah. Right. Can you say more more about that? Yeah, 100%. I was overjoyed with happiness, but I was also terrified. But I was also sad, and I was also wanting to. So we present outside of all of those feelings because I thought this might be the last week without my husband. Yeah. And I'm feeling all these things, and I can't even enjoy being with him. And. Yeah, absolutely. I mean, it sounds overwhelming, and I think you nailed it on the head. Is that often times when we encounter events, sometimes people kind of have that like, oh, it's just one emotion. And then, you know, when another emotion comes in, they're like, oh no, I can't, I don't have time for that one. And and you're absolutely right. Like you can just be like a whole tornado of, you know, a million different emotions and that they all kind of are valid because they're probably trying to tell you something. Right. Exactly. Yeah, absolutely. Okay. So you got this. You've a week before. Oh my goodness. So tell me more kind of how does it go from there. So then he leaves. I was living nearby his, his family, which I had become very close with systems all the time with them. But I was also in grad school, driving an hour up to grad school, so a lot of time. Oh, wow. Yeah, those are scary times. Over the over that summer, we had moved down, yeah, farther away. But I was only going to school like, two days out of the week. And, you know, at my internship, like the other three days, wasn't quite as far as going to school. So anyway, so I was busy. But I was feeling a lot of cramping and pain. Okay. And I was certain that I was losing. Oh, wow. I was able to go visit him before he shipped out in Indiana, for just a couple days. So it was after I had been to visit him. They came back, and I was just feeling a lot of sensations. And I would call and they would say, it's normal to have some cramping and everything. You know, it's fine. Just wait till you're okay. Another lesson for like, the beginning of many lessons that you really need to stand up for yourself. You know, I've heard several parents now say that exact same thing, and I would love to know kind of your your perspective on why that is so important and maybe what for you was kind of your barrier, your struggle for, as you mentioned, and standing up for yourself? Yeah. I mean, I feel like this could be a whole other like hour and a half. Yeah, because I am a doer. And so I do like in that medical space, there's a lot of, work that I do with my clients to empower them to speak up for themselves. Okay. And I think. It's interesting because my husband's a firefighter, so I hear a lot of his stories from, like, the medical side. Okay. From from that perspective. Yeah. People get burned out. People say things a lot of times, and, there's nothing to back it up. Right? Like people will say, you know, my pain is at a ten right now, but they're saying it like that. And he says to people, you know, just so you know, if your pain was like a ten, like you would be screaming like, you know. Yeah. So do you want to adjust your pain scale kind of thing? So I understand where the medical side is coming from. Yeah. At the same time, even more so that's why we need to speak up for ourselves, medical space or whatever. Because only we know our bodies. Yeah, and only we know our experience. And whether everybody else in the room has had that experience, and they're having a different reaction doesn't make a difference to you. It's your reaction, and it's your body and it's your feelings and they deserve to be heard. Yeah. And so I kept calling okay. Because I was like, I am not comfortable. Yeah. I do not feel like I feel like something is wrong. And I really need to come in. Yeah. And they finally said, okay, fine, you can come in with. Wow. And that's so hard, especially as a first time parent. And I finally explained to them when I got in, I said, look, my husband's deployed right now. Yeah, I am alone in this and I am having all of these thoughts and I just really need somebody to reassure me or not know what's going on. But I really just need to check in and figure out what's going on. Yeah. And that was the one appointment that I went to because it was last minute that my mother in law did not come with me. Okay. So, so she does the ultrasound. I ended up switching practices. As a side note that in hindsight, I'm like, where was she looking? Because anybody who's been pregnant knows that when you are that early, you look down here on an ultrasound. She was looking up here. I don't know if it was her first day or first hour, like I don't know what was going on. Okay. Anyway, so she said I can't find a heartbeat cause that's my worst nightmare. Yeah. So I am like, okay, all right. Like, this is happening. She said, don't don't give up hope. We're going to do an international ultrasound just to make sure, just so I can see. Okay. So we go in and the picture comes up. And I remember thinking a lot going on in that picture. And she said oh my. Oh those words come out of the person looking inside of you. Oh my oh my. And I said is there something wrong. Yeah. And she said oh no there's nothing wrong. There's just two of them. Oh wow. So that's how I found out I was having twins after the oh my the, oh my and the insistence that I be seeing. Yes, I obviously would have found out eventually. Right. But the earlier the better when you find out about those things. Yeah. Big news. It's big news to kind of you're pregnant, you know there's more than one there's more than one of them there. Yeah. So and they explained to me that it made a lot of sense, and they then validated my experience. Well, we felt a sense that you were feeling so much pain because this is your first pregnancy. And with twins, everything goes slowly. Yeah. So everything that should be expanding a little bit slowly is going faster. Everything's happening faster and more. And so it makes sense that you're feeling a lot of cramping. Wow. Yeah. Okay. Yeah. Well thank you. That's what I've been saying. Thanks for finally listening to me. Okay. Can I put this guy in now or or wait till he's a little bit more? I would wait till it's like. Yeah, no, you can put it in. Okay. But I would maybe put in, like, half of all of that. Sounds good. I can do that. Because once it's cooked, I kind of like to break the broccoli up. Okay. Yeah. Yeah. Okay. So. So I found out that it was twins. Okay. And I will never forget. I forget a lot of things now that I had kids, but I will never forget. It was on a Tuesday that I found out. Oh, wow. And I was not going to tell my husband that we were expecting to until Friday. So, I mean, holding all of that news and just that experience I imagine can be just so, I mean, to use the word again, overwhelming. Yeah. Yeah, it was very overwhelming. I like to say that I was naive enough to be really excited. Tell me more about that word. Well, it was just, you know, after they came was not, it was not easy. Oh. Okay. And so I, had I known, had I had, you know, a child already or something, I would have been a little bit more frightened. And I was conscious, of my first rodeo. At that point, I didn't know. Okay. I mean, I was a little scared, but I would have been a lot more scared. I really now. Okay, so walk me through kind of now, your thought process, you know, you've got twins, like you said, kind of. Everything's moving twice as fast. And again, you're doing this without your parent partner. There. So what was that experience like? I understand you know, it's kind of my at that time kind of all you knew. Right. But I imagine that that's such a tough journey to do. There was a lot of, there was a lot of just like, this is just what it is. Okay. I tried really hard not to think about whether he was in danger. Just like we were emailing back and forth. That was our primary mode of communication. Okay. There was a phone with the unit, but it was only, he could only use it like once a week or so. Okay. So yeah, I mean, I was just kind of like, trying to put him out of my mind. Luckily, I did have my grad school, my internship. That kept me pretty busy. Okay. They were very supportive. They gave me a baby shower. Your grad program did okay, I saw pictures, I was sitting in the classroom, and, like, they had to say all these things, and. Oh, wow. Yeah, they were very, very supportive. And then my family was very supportive. My mom came out to visit. She was living in Virginia at the time, to visit multiple times. I just, I thought I really felt a sense of community around me. Wow. Which was very helpful. Yeah. And I imagine, you know, I've heard from other families where they don't necessarily always have some of that community. And so that is wow, just so awesome that you were able to find some of those people. And then those people were able and willing to show up for you in that way. It sounds like. Totally. Yeah. And I think that set the stage for me always finding a community. Okay. And like, no, because like we moved a couple times and, just I've just always sought out my group to, you meet your group? Yeah. How do people when when you moved to these places, was it kind of coming naturally to you, or were there specific, like, tips or tricks that you had? Because I hear that all the time. Like, it's so hard as grown ups to meet friends and to find your people. Yeah. So I, I was very much into the attachment parenting world. Okay. So I found that initially through like, a very random, connection. But she was somebody that was really there for me after the twins were born around, I had wanted I was adamant that I would try to nurse them. Even though doctor told me it was possible, literally, and told me that I should not even try, because there was no way that I would be able to keep up with their needs. And I just shouldn't even try to just kind of resign yourself to the fact that you're just to get them. I mean, I can appreciate, you know, maybe their intent was to to alleviate some of that pressure, right? I mean, they knew my situation, right? Yeah. I wasn't was going to be there, but I said something I really want to do. Yeah. To kind of just be like, oh, here's something I really want to do. Don't do that. Yeah. I mean, again, talking about that invalidation of what your thoughts, your feelings, your you know, your plan or the ideas that maybe you have in your head. And then, yes, if it doesn't necessarily pan out in the way you're, you know, wanting to kind of yeah, flexibility. That's definitely something I think we need this period. Yeah. But altering of expectations. Yeah, absolutely. But it's also really important to trust your intuition, which I did over and over again. Yeah. Many situations and that has never I've never been steered wrong by feeling like I did what I felt in my heart was the right thing to do. Yeah. You know, and I really thought for that, I think that's it's so important to hear, especially for anybody out there who's been struggling with just that, like trusting your gut and kind of because our brains are really good at telling us all the ways that it's going to maybe not work out or fail. And so it can be really easy to, to get stuck in that. And so to kind of hear you say that, at least in your experience firsthand, trusting your gut has really kind of been an asset to you. It sounds like. Yeah, yeah. And I feel like it is definitely important to recognize that there's the anxiety parts of us that serve us well. But also can sometimes tell us things that aren't true. Yeah. And there's our intuition part and there's some crossover there sometimes, but trying to have spaces where we're quiet, you know, where we can really just kind of, like, try and go in and figure out, like what? What is my gut telling me? Yeah, I of the fear. And outside of the big thing of the other people's expectations, what is it that I want? What do I feel? Yeah. Just for me and my family in this situation, did you find that that was kind of most helpful for you in being able to navigate, like you said and tease out which which were kind of the anxiety speaking to me right now, which were the intuition, kind of the gut. Yeah. And I would really go back to my community a lot. Okay. Once I found that, you know, that my good friends, like, I would end up talking to my good friends like, this is what I feel. What do you what do you think? Like really finding those people that you can trust, you can have those conversations with to have that back and forth and just have like that sounding board. Okay. It's really important. Yeah. But so my that one friend was a huge support to me. I said, no, I want to nurse. And she said you can do it. And she got me the name of a lactation consultant that ended up talking to me so often for free. Wow. I never even met her. But I would leave her messages and she would call me back, like right away. She talked me through all the things. My friend would come over and make me dinner. She would bring her kids over and just sit with me. I would take my kids over there and I would lay in her bed and take naps. I mean, just, wow, that kind of community. That made me feel supported even though I didn't have my partner there. Yeah, absolutely. And I think again, for, you know, if you're a parent supporter out there, you think that that's such valuable information and ways to be able to show up for these people in your life. In a capacity that maybe they actually could really appreciate and need versus, like you said, maybe some of those people that are coming in thinking they know better. So I'm going to do the things that, you know, I think, right, I should be doing, which it sounds like in your experience, it was what do you need? And how can I kind of help you in that way? Yeah. And I talk with my postpartum clients a lot about that. Even my birth for clients. Like whatever you think you may need, you're ready for it to change first of all. Yeah, because once you have that baby, everything blows up right? It blows up. And you're like, what? Who am I? What is going on? What is my life now? Yeah. And and be ready to be really honest and set really good boundaries about what is going to be helpful. Even if that means you're gonna piss people off. Yeah. Fine. It gets you pissed off. You get to have what you need. Yeah. And that's such a good reminder folks that you know they, they're totally entitled to feeling pissed off. That's fine. That's their own emotions. At the same time. Exactly. You're not responsible. You don't need to feel that pressure of taking that on. And then kind of essentially, as I say, like manage other people's emotions. You got your own stuff and now you've got new baby, you've got your hands full. You don't necessarily need to take on and have all that external stuff. Yeah, yeah. I'll never forget my mother in law, who I adored and has passed. We had a lot of conversations as my kids got older and, she expressed to me how I raised my kids so differently than she did, but she had so much respect for how I had done it. Well, and we really came to that together because, like, I'll never forget she said at one point, you know, the twins, it was wild. I didn't put them on a schedule. Had to nurse them, man, because I needed I really wanted to know something that meant I had to just nurse on demand. Yeah. So I had put somebody down for a nap and then somebody else a little bit later, and somebody woke up and they started crying, and I was like, oh, I can't forget this baby. Yeah. And she said, you know, you can let them cry. And I said, I don't want to. Yeah, I want to let them cry. I know that people do. I don't want to. And she said, at some point you going to have to let them cry. You know. Not wow. And she kind of like. Let's see how that goes. Yeah. But like I said we really came to an understanding I did things differently. And that was okay. Yeah. And it was okay that she did things differently. I respect how she did it. Yeah I needed to do it how I felt like I wanted to. Yeah. It's all right to me. Was that kind of as you moved and maybe as you mentioned kind of her her telling you hey I, I respect kind of that you did things differently in it and you were able to kind of stick to your guns in that way. Was that what was validating was, I mean, what was going on for you in that moment? Because I imagine that that many of our parents are experiencing. I think there's so much of that new wave of parents nowadays kind of looking at it and saying, just because that's how it's always been done doesn't mean that's how I have to do it or how I want to do it. And they're stepping outside of the box and that can be really scary. Terrifying. Yeah. And so, you know, to then have someone who maybe is from that, that group that we're telling you kind of, you know, I don't I don't know if you, you know, this is appropriate to kind of then have them come back and say, okay, I get it, I see you. Yeah, yeah. Was that what was your experience when you heard that? I think it just validated for me, like me listening to what I felt was right for me. And I think that's, that's the big kind of like like. For me a lot of times is that like if you're doing what you feel like in your gut is really the right thing, then you're going to feel more confident, okay, about what's going on. Yeah. And that confidence will be important to your children. And that confidence will be portrayed to the people around you. Yeah. If you're if you're okay with your kid tantrum, and then return it because you, you know, don't want to do what everybody else thinks that you should do. But you feel confident that this is the right role. Yeah. And people are going to just be like oh you got it. You know. Yeah. Versus you standing there be like oh my God you're doing that internally. Absolutely. There's just there's a sense of like confidence and surety that comes with following your gut. And I feel like joy, eases everybody through the process. Yeah. So that's not it's not. And I'm not saying that, like, everybody should do it how I did it. But just like when you're following what you feel is right for you, then I feel like things will flow and feel more comfortable for everybody. You're like that, like confident leader. And it sounds like for you kind of being able to do that. Like you said, trust yourself that it was coming from a place of figuring out what your values were and really kind of doing that value driven life and kind of plan, if you will. And finding the confidence in that. Yeah, to be able to stand on your two feet despite kind of all the naysayers, right. And say, hey, you know, I'm going to I'm going to give this a try and I'm going to give it a try because it aligns with the things that are super important to me, super valuable as far as like my morals, my beliefs, etc.. Exactly. Yeah. And that's actually not to like fuck the business, but that is something that I really want for the parents that I work with. And something that we talk about is being intentional. Okay. And like kind of setting your, your values and imagining what you want for your child in 20 years because your throwing a person. Yeah. You know, you're building a human. You're not like you are managing day to day behavior or something of a wild toddler, but the way in which you do that is going to form the person that they are in 15 years. Yeah. And so having that like bigger picture in mind about like what kind of person you're trying to raise, working backwards from that will help inform you how you handle those daily day to day struggles. Yeah. With the kids. And I think because of the community that I was in and my education, I just read a bunch like I just became very clear on what those were. Yeah. Early on. And so I'm curious, kind of going back to bringing these babies into the world, kind of on your own. Did you have all of that already kind of formula? I don't know, okay. No, I mean, so so why do we do that beginning process? I mean, even just the fact of like, giving birth and without your parent partner there and then now, like you said, kind of here are these people that, you know, humans that you're planning on growing, like you said, you're looking at that future going on, want them to kind of be thriving and successful and whatever that looks like for them. Walk me through that process. What was going on for you in those moments of doing that and doing that flow? In that sense? Yeah, the theme of that thing. But it was incredibly overwhelming. Yeah. Because, you know, my, my values and what I wanted for them at that point, it was really difficult. Like, I really wanted to nurse them. I didn't want to force them into a schedule. I felt like, okay, you know, they were also a little, not super little, but little enough that I really I couldn't put them on a schedule yet. I really needed to be fed as much as they would eat. Okay. So, I it was incredibly hard, and I hated it. Yeah. I don't know about that kind of. Yeah, that idea, like I said earlier, like, you know, I tell my moms, like, if it's going to be an explosion after you, like, whatever you think you may feel like, don't count on that. And, and it's okay if you are really, really excited to have this baby. And once it becomes you're like, what did I do? Yeah. That's okay. Doesn't mean you're a bad mom. It doesn't mean you shouldn't have done it for holding both things. Yeah, right. You're excited to have a new baby, and you're like, Holy crap, I just blew up my life. What did I do? Yeah, and I think that's really important to say normalize, because that happens. Not to everybody. Yeah, but it does happen to enough people that they think that they're bad or wrong or like, oh my God, I shouldn't have been a mom. Yeah, because I'm feeling this way. And that's so true. Absolutely. Anything that you hit right on has it normalizing it because that parent guilt can be really just really toxic to kind of use a buzzword. But it's so true because like you said, sometimes you may look at it and there were these, I can say, even just for my own self, you know, that I was like, what did I do, you know, was this a mistake? And if I'm not enjoying this, you know, when you see you're like, oh, having a baby for me, you know, like, yes. And then sure that when you're feeling anything but that, like feeling right to be lonely. Yeah. To sit in that and feel like, oh, what's wrong with me as a person? It must be me, right? I wanted this, yeah, I asked for this, and here they are. And I hate them. I remember I, you know, one of my babies that was one of the baby showers in there, and I got so many matching outfits and I remember, like, holding office and just being like, oh, my, so amazing. When they got my husband sitting there, actually. And I would say probably two weeks after I had them, my mom was living with me. My dad had come out to also stay with me and help. Okay. And I was super sleep deprived. Yes. Just like my husband, I hear like this just explosion. Like my life has just been turned upside down, and I'm not happy about it. Yeah, and I was just crying. So my parents and I looked at them and my mom said something to the effect of like, well, you know, you you couldn't have carried them for your whole life kind of trying to joke around, you know, like, okay. Like they couldn't have been inside forever. They, they had to come out eventually. I looked at her and I said, put them back. Yes. Like but like not joking. Oh, if you can put them back, I will live with them in my stomach forever. Yeah, I don't care. I just don't want to be where I am, doing what I'm doing. I'm miserable. Yeah, absolutely. And I think that's such a real again, call the real family to people because we're talking about real stuff and I. I totally can appreciate that. I remember, you know, similar to my second kid, I wanted him to cook for as long, like, everyone's like an aunt away from, you know, like, please stay in there as long as you can because I'm not ready. Yeah. I'm not. No. You know, I'm like, you say I, I swear I've, I've not only myself, but I've heard that from other folks where, there are times where you're like, please just put them, put them back. I don't, I don't know, right. I unsubscribe from this. How do I get out of this exactly. And that and and not to say that I didn't love them or enjoy moments with them. Yeah. But but there was a real joy, like resentment and regret. And grief. Yeah. I find that so often lately, like, I'm reflecting on how much grief comes with parenting. Can you say more about that? Because I think that's so important. I'm going to start crying. Hey, here's the reason. Just, you know, I grieved my wife before. I wanted it I wanted everything changes and nothing's ever going to be the same after you have those babies. And I grieved that I heavily I was getting my master's because I was going to be a social worker. And after the kids came, I didn't want to work. And I was privileged enough to be able to do that, but it was a constant struggle of like, wait, I picked this, right? I picked mom to go to work because I feel completely worthless in this job of staying home with these two things that just take, take, take, take, take, take. Yeah. And I resented and grieved that I didn't have this academic and, like meaningful social work or life that I had imagined myself having, like my husband. I joked around about it because when we first got together, he said, you know, I'm not going to be a millionaire or anything, but like, I could make it work if you didn't work well, you don't have to work if you don't want to. And I looked at it like it was the start of an argument because I was like, don't you know me? Like I'm applying to master's programs, I'm getting my master's. I'm working. I want to work. Yeah. How would you say that to me? And then it just got completely flipped on its head when those babies came out. Yeah. I was like what the hell. This whole time I thought this was what I was going to be. So was grieving that just like so much. Yeah. And at every stage it hits creep not having babies because my oldest ones went to college this past year and that was like, oh my goodness. And it was like, just tear my heart out. Yeah. Absolutely incredible grief. Yeah. And I really appreciate you being willing to to be real with us. That grief is absolutely a part of that. And like you said, in so many different ways, you know, I've like you said, you know, changing maybe some of your, your past. You know, I think that many of us parents, we, we sit there as kids kind of drawing in our notebooks or, you know, kind of zoom in, you know, what's it going to be like. And sometimes it doesn't always pan out more often than it doesn't always pan out in those exact ways. And that there is those feelings of grief. You know, I've worked with folks who sometimes even have the grief of like, ones that are all one, you know, one gender that kind of comes out in kind of the grief of not having a girl or not having a boy or, you know, whatnot. Or for some, you know, I've talked to, a family a couple of episodes ago that, you know, where it was a grief of then, a diagnosis that's kind of issued. And again, it's not necessarily following what you had or as, like you said, even that milestone of becoming those empty nesters. Like, that's a very real thing because like you said, now you're setting this heart outside of you away and hoping and praying that you know they're prepared and that they're doing stuff. And gosh, that's so hard. And, I appreciate kind of your willingness to normalize with that happens. Absolutely. And it doesn't make you any less of a parent. Right? In fact, it makes you a real hero. Right? That's very real far. Yeah. Yeah, absolutely. And so I'm so curious, like with all these things that you've learned, was there at any moment kind of like a moment for you where it was able to kind of click, like you said, to be able to kind of hold that space for the grief, hold the stage for the joy as well. And then having those things be possible at the same time. Joy is still working on. Yeah. That's, you know, if we're ever done. Yeah. Well, it's like never like I figured that out. Mastered because there's always, there's always a new kid. There's always a new stage. There's always a new personality. I mean, there's just there's so much that has come up that I just feel like everything is like just a reminder. You're not in control. You know that, right? Yeah. You know. Right. You have control. Here you go. Yeah. You're like, this happened just for you. Just a reminder. Yeah. And I think that if anything, the moment is like, I'm not in control. And there's going to be. And it's never done. Yeah. You know, I'm not in control this whole process. They're going to go out and, you know, live their lives. And I'm not in control of that. And they're going to come to me with things still. And and I'm still going to have to hold all of these emotions and grief and love and sadness and joy. And it's just it's never going to. Yeah. Is that scary? Because I know it's never going to end. I think no, I think where I've gotten to now is the acceptance of those things, the realization, the acceptance that this is this is the journey. Yeah. This is the it's never the same again. It's just going to keep growing and changing. And I just have to keep changing and growing with it. Yeah. Really the only option and it sounds like kind of going back to something you said earlier, finding those ways to stay present in that moment, to be able to say, you know, it is what it is. These are things, like you said, that are out of my control. What are the things that I can control? And some of that is our perspective. Some of that is you're you're work to be able to stay present and say, you know what, I, I'm going to do my darndest to, to be able to show up, not just physically but mentally, emotionally and kind of be there. Yeah. Yeah, that's that's an incredible story, an incredible journey. I mean, looking back now, I know you've got cancer research kind of on your, resources right there on your website, that you offer. But is there anything else that you found kind of along the lines that would be helpful for any of our parents that maybe are in a similar situation? Is is you have having, I think just reaching out and trying to find your community. Whatever that looks like, you know, find something that interests you and then connect with people who also interest them, parenting related or not. Okay. You know, for me, I think a lot of it ended up being attachment parenting. But I okay. And I met and there was a period of time where I was going to a knitting store up in Marietta, and I was like once a week I would sit with ladies that were probably like 40 years my senior, and it was like my favorite part of the week. Wow. Because I heard them talking about their kids and I heard them just they were two different things and they were okay. Yeah. You know, it's like light at the end of the tunnel. Yeah. Just like anything that just feeds your cup. And keeps your soul. Yeah. To just help you get back to those values. And just to keep kind of like pulling you back to wherever your center is so that you can either in time be present. And it sounds like being able to also maybe give yourself the okay to invest in yourself. But it doesn't always have to be. And I can't keep taking kids totally. Yeah. It's so easy to lose yourself. And I have lost myself. Yeah, multiple times. But you just have to work to, you know, find yourself again. Yeah. And different activities and even, like, I, you know, see posts on Facebook sometimes, like, you know, I'm so introverted and, and I definitely have an extroverted side to me. So I feel for that. That person who feels like God, it's like I need to reach out to somebody like, I get it, but find like a group of introverts. Yeah. Find people who enjoy movies, you know, like go to the movies together or something. It's you don't have to, like, talk a lot or just, like, just find something to connect with online. Yeah. And like anything, just find a way to connect with other people. Because that is what. That human connection is what really drives your ability to, like, just keep going. Yeah. And it's so needed. We are not meant to survive. Oh my gosh. Oh well no no there would be a lot of a lot lower population if we could just do that know. Yeah. Yeah. All right. So am I good. Is there anything else. I mix it all up pretty well okay. Yeah yeah that's great okay. And then you add like on the top a little bit of feta okay. Perfect. I just I just about you serve it that way we can I'm thinking like she my mom okay. Well this looks small for me. So thank you so much for being willing to do I mix it in I just it on I do like to leave it on top. Okay. I can do that. I don't know, somehow the kids always liked it. And if you mix it in, sometimes it like melts a little bit. You can't see it. It's not okay. So we want to let them know that there's there's something else in there as well. Appreciate that. Well, thank you so much for one, being willing to share this recipe with us. And our listeners, and also being willing to, to share part of your story and really helping with that cause the format that hurt and normalizing, like you said, can all of these difficulties that come up with parenting that we don't talk about enough? In my opinion? And it's it's really doing us a disservice 100%. Yes. Yeah. So thank you so much for being willing to do this today. So thank you for having me. Yes. Thank you all so much for listening. We'll see you next time. If you or anyone that you know is struggling with any of the topics that we discussed in today's episode, make sure to check out our show notes for support and resources. You can get help. So thanks again for joining us on today's episode of The Real Family Eat. If you're a parent ready to share your real life parenting story, make sure to reach out to us and our website found in the show notes. And that goes for today's recipe social media's support and resources. All of that can be found in our show notes, so make sure to check them out and make sure to follow, like, share, subscribe, and stay up to date on all things the real family. I hope you'll join us next time for more food for thought and thoughtful food! Enjoy your eat!